Do local gateways interact?

I have a follow up question here:

There exists an existing gateway in my neighborhood and I do not want to disturb it.

But I like to have my own TTIG as well.

Can I limit Transmit Power somehow to avoid too strong interaction. Also I don’t like it to send with the full 27dBm .
Didn’t find out how to achieve this yet.

Having this device radiating my small flat with 500mWatts (which is 27dBm right?) is maybe a little much in all cases ^^

Not really a followup question so I’ve split the thread.

The LoRaWAN Network Server controls the transmission power based on regional settings. Gateways mostly listen - like 90% of the time - so they don’t tend to conflict with each other and the chances of two local ones transmitting at the same time are vanishingly small due to the way the LNS selects the best gateway for a downlink.

I think the TTIG would probably glow red hot if it managed to transmit at 27dBm but long before then the federal authorities would have dragged you in to court. But if it’s been told it’s in the EU, it won’t try.

Hey thanks for that answer!

I thought the datasheet spoke of 27dBm sending power?

Am I getting something wrong here?

Anyway, it’s there a way to manually limit the sending power of the device?

That is device capability - they ship globally and regulations in each region are different and so device actual config and operation is set accordingly. In e.g UK, Germany, Italy or where ever - as under EMEA EU868 regs - when you set a device up you define operation/freq plan and LNS configured to limit to the nominal 16dbm EU limits :slight_smile: There are thousands out there and nothing of concern, even in places like US where full capabiliies can be utilised. Note in EU there are duty cycle and power limits that are also applied, whereas say the US and others apply Dwell Time limits - 400mS for US - that limit time on air, and for most responses TX is in the same RX1 freq channel as sent by the node, but the RX2 channel is chosen to allow for higher DC and TX power as and when needed (if you follow the TTN recommended settings on registration from the available drop down menu). Note this is only for GW download to node in RX2 window and as such is a short and (should be) infrequent event - this isnt like wifi or you mobile phone where signals are merrily chirping away almost continuously in normal operation :slight_smile: GW’s ignore each other and can discriminate between another GW TX’ing and an end node due to how the RF symbols are constructed and packets sent (too much detail for here!).

Note you wont ‘disturb’ the other GW in your neighbourhood (either by use - assuming you follow the Regulations and TTN FUP - or by deploying another GW in the area), indeed that is how the LoRaWAN system is architected - devices broadcast a message and all GW’s in range will hear and pass on to the LNS thereby providing extended optimised redundant services…still good you get you own GW though as adds to community coverage and redundancy and also assists with seeing what your device may be doing during any development/debug processes.

Yes, you aren’t stopping to wonder how everyone else does this without the information being evident.

If this was “a thing” it would be all over the instructions and the forum.

My car can do 130mph and luckily I can find a FaceBook forum that says I should try it at night on the motorway with the lights off - oh, wait …

Yeah, maybe.

I am just curious how to control sending power as I usually like to have it under my control.

I totally believe you in coexistence and so on. But it does not hurt if I want to take over control over a sender I would place in my house.

So the question remains, how can I donwregulate sending power if I want. I guess adapting the global config file ? But what do I.change in there ?

It does hurt because the network server doesn’t know about your manipulations and can’t take it into account. If it wants to use your gateway to send a response to a node and you dialed down the transmission power the node might not be reachable resulting in a denial of service caused by you. So if you don’t trust the technology you shouldn’t use it. BTW, most WiFi routers will use 1000-4000mW in the 5GHz band, do you dial back power on your access points as well?

Indeed I do limit my WiFi into the necessary range :slight_smile:

And I see your point somehow, but the DoS should not be possible in a failure safe WAN.

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But well, I will think about all of this and most likely will not buy a Gateway and extend the network under those conditions. But thank you all for your answers :slight_smile:

Then you are so going to hate LoRaWAN - any device transmitting in range of your gateway will have it’s transmission relayed up to TTN for processing. And at anytime your gateway may be commanded to send a downlink to someone else’s device.

Why are you ignoring the whole point that you don’t need to? You absolutely don’t need to put an artificial cap on the device as it just won’t go there.

Really? You make changes out of internationally agreed and ratified specification (ITU-T Y.4480) that the LNS can’t possibly know about and then expect it to automagically compensate.

But, and here’s the rub, no-one ever claimed that LoRaWAN was a fail-safe WAN. In fact you’ll find plenty of forum posts that point out that LoRaWAN is NOT for command & control and that packet loss of up to 10% should be tolerated as normal. It’s very good at long range low power battery powered sensors sending uplinks - rather asymmetrical, not really a WAN in the symmetrical sense.

This may be for the best for the TTN Community - having a compromised gateway on the network is not at all attractive to us.

However if you can bear to consider that the international community of professionals with hundreds of thousands of deployments of gateways and likely millions of devices may just know what it’s doing, feel free to join in.

PS, Seven of Nine would be disappointed, just saying.

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I think you all lined that out :wink:

Well nothing else than using my mobile phone I guess.

Still not saying no to those constraints.
By chance do you know if they will restock the Europe TTIG at some point ?