@CyBaart 2.4Ghz is more a TTI thing than TTN as, as far as I am aware, no TTN implementation and support as yet. TTN has a fair use policy which applies to both the on air utilisation and by extension the impact of the amount node of traffic on the free back end services, as opposed to legal duty cycle limits implied from
The example use case for 2.4Ghz LoRa/LoRaWAN is international shipping and logistics or similar global roaming use cases where a device may end up in any one of a number of different regulatory regimes and associated band plans, and won’t necessarily have knowledge or capability to change band plan and avoid becoming illegal! Indeed in extremis think of an actual ship itself where you might be monitoring not only cargo but also the ships infrastructure - engines, pumps, fuel/water levels, air con, motors, galley’s, crew quarters, etc. Where a device designed for use in say US suddenly becomes illegal when it sails into EU waters and docks in say Rotterdam, or heads to Tokyo Japan, or Souel S.Korea, or Haifa Israel… having LoRaWAN on 2.4 GHz suddenly becomes very attractive! Faster data rates are the cherry on the cake not the reason d’etre as such.
Also
DONT DO IT. Single channel packet forwarders, not Gateways, are not and can never be LoRaWAN compliant/capable and worse still become disruptive to other users on the same LoRaWAN networks. 5+ years later TTN is still battling to correct the mistakes inherent in allowing SCPF’s on the TTN network in the early days, and as with this post still trying to correct potential users impressions and re-educate wrt their use … Start 2.4Ghz ‘clean’ and don’t fall into that trap.
The amount of traffic is not the only consideration for the fair use policy. The policy is also in place to force users to consider playing nice on the shared resource of available airtime. With the legal limits a couple of hundred devices can saturate all channels making LoRaWAN unusable at that location and its surroundings.
Except that in looking up what a “real” 2.4 GHz gateway would cost and its carrying capacity, I just discovered that Semtech themselves are promoting using node radios on the network end, and as far as I can tell don’t even have a reference design for a concentrator-type 2.4 GHz gateway. One would think the SX130x could handle the baseband with a different RF chip; but maybe there are more differences. Or maybe they’re thinking non-LoRaWan schemes more than LoRaWan ones.
Anyway, what is currently available for 2.4 GHz is a box with three single-frequency single-SF node radios for uplink, and one for downlink (which sounds a lot like one of the more notorious not-a-gateway boxes we get questions about here…)
If TTN starts to support a bandplan, the real “mistake not to repeat” would be to not have a way to define the capabilities of a gateway when registering it - especially when starting from a position where nobody’s box is really a proper gateway.
One potentially interesting application, if TTN were ever to support 2.4Ghz LoRa, is that the SX1280 devices have the internal firmware to measure distances from ‘node’ to ‘gateway’ by measuring the time of flight of a packet exchange.
Yes, that was used for early demos of LoRa capabilities for potential indoor location/asset tracking or placement. Great fun was had doing customer intro’s/demos where one ST Eiger eval unit (such as later used for the SMTC LoRa EVK’s) with proto location enabled Si was hidden in customers office or factory then another handed to them and told go play ‘hot/hotter, cold/colder’ (using signal strength and ToF) to find the hidden unit. Placing in a higher or floor level position often foxed many as people don’t always look/think in 3 dimensions (think Star Trek - Wrath of Khan, nebula chase scene )
Early proto of what was finally to be baked into1280 wrt ‘ranging’ was demoed on early LoRa si proto/demo systems - on a P2P basis each speially configured Eiger was basically a node radio - long before we had GW’s … not to worry…your coment just triggered some old fond memories …moving on…
@Jeff-UK didn’t you read the part of my post where I specifically mentioned that we were using commercial gateways, the single channel gateway is ONLY used for testing, making sure the code works.
Even testing usage of a deficient device pretending to be a “gateway” would not be acceptable on TTN; if you want to do that, you must use your own isolated server infrastructure.
However, at present there’s nothing for 2.4 GHz which approaches the capabilities of a conventional gateway.
If/when TTN supports 2.4 GHz, it’s going to be absolutely critical that the support establish minimum standards for what is allowed to be registered as a gateway and/or provide multiple categories of registration.
Even the boxes with 3 node class radios basically preclude variable-SF ADR, since they can’t receive multiple SF’s. Variable power is still an option though…
Try looking at Geroskipou, Cyprus on the TTN gateway map. Not another device for miles.
Why don’t you all just stand me against the wall and shoot me, you would obviously rather do that than offer helpful advice. Sarcasm doesn’t help. Should be called TNN, the nasty network. Thanks a bunch.
Map only shows GWs where the owner has ticked the show public option… I know of at least 2 others deployed on the island which are not shown for security reasons…I can say no more than that.
You see, I read that TTN were intending playing trance at this particular 80s disco in the article I linked above, but then I’m only a pig ignorant ex pit electrician from stupid bastard Geordie land. Explaining to me WHY my single channel gateway, with the code SparkFun SPECIFICALLY points you to to get onto TTN, isn’t a good idea. After all, I must have limited intelligence if I read SparkFun tutorials.
And for ‘moving forward’ read ‘move away’ you win. Goodbye. I’m off and I’m glad I’m off.
Like I said, Thanks for not sharing your own hard earned intelligence, insight and knowledge in a useful way.
Why not, this is the definitive source of information & support for TTN - not that I can see a link to a SparkFun article in the above and at no point has anyone suggested you are of limited intelligence. There are many articles about SCPF for TTN on the web, none of which are valid anymore. Anyone coming on to the forum gets told the exact same thing, please don’t use them, please disconnect, please use a fully compliant gateway.
Seems right from the off when I put you in touch with the author of the code that you referenced it wasn’t going to end well. But we are still here if you have other questions, but at present TTN doesn’t yet support 2.4GHz
Gods own country (well 2nd only to N.West!) - Family/friends up that way inc some (ex-Pit) friends (one now minus a lung!) now hosting GW’s on my behalf for the benefit of the ‘Geordie’ Community having initiated a community up that way some 2 years ago. If you would like to pick your chip up and perhaps use Forum search (look for Single Channel Gateway, Single Channel Packet Forwarders -SCPF’s, etc.) you will find reasons
We cant control the internet and it hates sensorship but where these were thought to be a good idea to get into LoRa & TTN in the early days (5+ years ago when full GW’s cost >>$1000) they have been depricated, and now actively discouraged, for TTN use for about 3 years now. We would have such posts corrected, but we cant and it took years to get some suppliers of S/DCPF’s to finally amend their product info to say LoRa private/proprietary only not TTN/LoRaWAN…and their sales channels have taken even longer
The key route for (initially) sharing knowledge on this forum is via the search function… thereafter we are all happy to dive in and help on specifics, where people have helped themselves… be they electricians (surely wouldnt deploy equipment in a pit without reading up on it 1st?!), bakers, priests, policemen, networking experts or even sales guys
@Baart Are you now Cyprus based or still in Geordie land? If latter may be worth joining one of the 4 N. East communities to get help from others in the area (Newcastle, Tyne Valley, Consett or Durham) - TTNUK - https://www.thethingsnetwork.org/country/united-kingdom/
If Cyprus based there are 60+ members across 4 communities:
)
…moving on…
- Family/friends up that way inc some (ex-Pit) friends (one now minus a lung!) now hosting GW’s on my behalf for the benefit of the ‘Geordie’ Community having initiated a community up that way some 2 years ago. If you would like to pick your chip up and perhaps use Forum search (look for Single Channel Gateway, Single Channel Packet Forwarders -SCPF’s, etc.) you will find reasons
